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I just saw this gifset so I think I know what you’re talking about: https://cathy-parr.tumblr.com/post/617063530968055808
And thanks for being mindful! Although in this case I’m not really avoiding spoilers so I’ve picked up little tidbits here and there already.
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Not yet, no! Now that it’s finally here, I feel oddly reluctant to sit down and start. Sometimes hype makes me really want to watch something, sometimes I’m scared to start and be disappointed or worse, love it and have no more of it. Also, you know. It’s a movie. I still haven’t watched A Secret Love either. (Or The Favourite or Carol or The Handmaiden. :x) But I hope you enjoyed it!
And another two anons (one is mildly spoilery and negative):
<tried to insert a read more here, it wouldn’t do it…oh…it inserted the link in the ask itself, freaking geniuses>
I just watched the half of it and it wasn’t bad? I mean towards representation is not the best movie ever but it was nice and like the way it was shot was great?
The half of it vaguely spoilerish if you haven’t seen it yet… I am so glad I found out ahead of time that this wasn’t a lesbian rom com Bc whew I woulda been pissed watching it had I not known that. As it was, I was honestly kinda bored a lot of the movie. I love Alice Wu and she made very lovable characters in Ellie & Aster, but this movie had so much focus on Paul. I’m sick of white boys dominating narratives honestly. He wasn’t a fresh character at all but he was still so much the focus.
These two came in so close together this morning, they made me laugh. You’re like two sides of the same coin, all, yeah, I guess it was okay??
To the first anon, heh, you seem unsure? You can like it or even love it without any issue! It DOES hit a lot of rep points, unless it’s willfully apathetic or offensive, I feel like you’re free to enjoy what it is more than add disclaimers for what it isn’t. If you enjoyed it, that’s awesome.
To the second anon, well, I get it. Maybe that’s why I’m not in a rush to watch. I’m not currently in the mood for a story that is basically, in Wu’s own words, an attempt to reach out to people who made Trump happen. And okay, that’s not fair, it’s so many more things, a coming of age story for an Asian American lesbian teen, the story of a second gen immigrant and her dad in a small American town, among other things, friendship between seemingly fundamentally different people, how to grow and learn past learned biases, even the effects of religion on Aster. And heck, even if it were just the first thing, that’d be an admirable goal, let alone the many other things it manages to be to so many people. I’m not saying it has to be something different.
But if this movie has two main roles, to teach empathy to an external group and to be relatable to an inner group, it is…neither of those things to me. I’m a Southeast Asian American who grew up abroad, my experiences are very different from Ellie’s and while I have a bunch of guy friends, I don’t care about Paul. Which will probably change when I actually watch, the way I love Dutch and Johnny in Killjoys. Or currently, Isaac on Vagrant Queen. I end up liking a lot of male characters, tbh. I dunno. I guess it’s what the focus is Presented as. Ellie may be the lead of THOI, but a movie’s inherent lack of time forces Paul and their dynamic to be so central, and a part of me does resent that a bit. It’s sold as a different kind of love story, their dynamic itself is the main character.
It could be a combination of many things, a difference between what I want and what it is, the fact that it’s a movie and just didn’t have the time I like to develop. I really liked In My Skin, a TV show, and that wasn’t particularly relatable, I guess I’m more open to stories when the female lead is front and center in every way. The story is about her. It’s like in Stumptown, I FAR preferred the episodes that treated Dex as the main than those where Grey or Hoffman had some adventure and Dex was just, like, there.
But annnyway. It’s fine, right, we don’t have to like everything. I get the FOMO, something like this is so big and the f/f community’s still so small, it’s hard to ignore it and everyone around us engaging with it in some way. But aren’t we reaching a point where we don’t have to like something because it’s f/f but can go on to something else? Well. I say that as someone who prefers TV to movies, because damn, pickings are slim if you want happy central f/f in movies. Honestly, that’s really what it comes down to, the issue isn’t this movie but that there aren’t enough f/f movies out there. Every one of these discussions boils down to that basic point, that this one movie shouldn’t be responsible for everything this industry’s failed to do. You don’t have to like this movie, but you should have the opportunity to watch more than one happy ending every few years.
Okay, this I also really wish I’d answered earlier, since now we’re just a week away, but. On the other hand, nothing we say would have made a difference to people complaining. And I certainly wasn’t calling it bad or queerbaiting, which, I don’t even use that word anymore when it comes to f/f rep, canon OR subtext. I have a lot of thoughts about it, but ultimately, it’s just not very useful.
But yeah, of course, I do think people should be allowed to have complaints, but also, it’s just courtesy to not ruin it for others. Given how talented but also thoughtful Alice Wu tends to be, even if people have seen the script, the execution and end product do matter a lot. And ultimately, even if it is exactly what the script and trailer promise and disappoints people hoping for a more romcom execution, it’s unfair to sum up something’s objective quality based on subjective preferences.
But people are going to vent and rant on their blogs, you may just want to be careful about visiting the tags, or just try to ignore it. Surely the negative comments are the exception.
Cont. of date anon, As well as I’m not sure how many people remember Sierra Burgess is a big loser. But it kind of dealt with the same topics of helping another person get their crush. And after it came out people had an issue with it, because while we like to imagine it as a cute story you tell later in life. It is actually a person being misled and lied to about who they thought they knew and realistically I don’t think in RL any type of relationship would work out.
Last part. I think I believe Ms. Wu realizes this as well. Like you mentioned there is not a whole lot of happy W/W romcoms out there and to create one based on a lie doesn’t seem like a thing she would do. I would prefer if they built up the friendship between Elie and Paul and used it as a way to show that starting a relationship off with a lie doesn’t help anyone and by putting Aster on a pedestal they don’t really learn about the real her.
I’m so sorry it took so long to reply, especially since we have an ongoing correspondence. 😛 Now it looks silly when I say “Yay! You got your trailer early”, because it’s almost two weeks after. D:
Yeah, it does look like it’ll be more about the friendship and coming of age and her identity as a second-gen Asian American in a small town.
I…don’t remember anything about Sierra Burgess is a Loser, which I had to google just now. I honestly haven’t seen any of these, I just know vaguely that one is about a tall girl and one is about a kissing booth, one of course is TATBTILB which was ALL over my dash. I had no idea that people had an issue with it, I feel like there’s a lot more leeway given to romcoms and of course movies in general that people wouldn’t tolerate in real life, but it doesn’t surprise me that people point out objectionable things more now.
But anyway, in this case, I get what you’re saying about how this relationship works (or doesn’t), but I don’t even think that needs to be said. It’s not as if the premise was the actual obstacle to a relationship, if it were, she could have just written a different one. It’s just not the focus, dearth of f/f romcoms or not, this wasn’t intended to be one and then changed because she realized it didn’t work, it was just never meant to be that. And that’s totally fine.
That’s a totally valid way for you to look at media, anon, but I’ve got my way too. And I could say, well, it’s relevant how this discourse only seems to come up for same-sex and interracial couples, who’ve had to fight to exist and be represented, and the lack of media romance and happy endings for them is for a reason. Or that to have representation of characters with AND without romance/happy wlw endings, we kind of have to still have the happy wlw endings and we’re quite short on those. Or that we don’t have to be in real life what we want to see in fiction.
But none of that’s needed as a justification because at the end of the day, I like romance. I like happy endings. I want to see them. And that’s fair too, and for others who want that.
Yes, exactly, please, Netflix, make more queer romcoms! Or…any?
But this does show, I think, how much the expectations around this are affecting the framing. I still think, as someone who would have preferred it to be more classic romcom, that it’ll be a fun watch. I don’t think the crush and the guy will end up together, unless things have changed in the extreme, but even with the focus away from the romance, you liked Saving Face and a lot of it was also about Wil and her mom and even, separately from Will completely, the mom’s romance with the young guy and how the community was maneuvering around that.
I think a lot about this is the execution and I feel like it’ll be well done enough that we’ll still be happy. Even though the focus won’t be on Ellie and Aster, their moments will be sprinkled around in such a way that we’ll still be repeatedly reminded of them.
Lol, I have no idea either. To be accurate, I”m seeing more of the defense of THOI than I am the actual negativity, so it might have been a similar reaction back then, just more amplified now. I do think the era makes a difference too, this is six years later. Now everyone, not just f/f fans or even fandom in general, is so much louder and…MORE on social media. But I’d also say that, as loud as the outcry over things like Willow/Tara and Glee (in general) were, the f/f community specifically has become more vocal about what it doesn’t like and why. And every year, every movie that brings along another unhappy ending just adds to how much people are waiting for one.
I think maybe also what would have been different for that one is that while people would have groaned at the initial premise of Life Partners, it did seem like a friendship between a straight girl and a lesbian from the offing? So it was more a muted “oh, this again” from the start, instead of what we got here, people getting excited over thinking THOI was a f/f romcom in the vein of TATBTILB and then being disappointed.
Since URLs aren’t allowed in asks, the person sending it broke it apart, you have to remove spaces and extra characters to get it to actually work. Usually I make them linkable when I answer but I felt like I should make it harder this time, to add a layer of protection for people who didn’t want to be spoiled? But eh, here it is: https://gofile.io/?c=x9S77g If you can’t click on even that, perhaps your ISP or country is banned and you want to try a VPN?
And thanks! Y’all don’t have to add a blog appreciation tithe every time you have a question or comment, heh.
Ah, cool! And a whole bunch of other scripts. Thanks for looking out! And thanks for the kind words!
Nooo, they’re not! Are they?? Nooooooo. Surely it’s just a teeny tiny group of people.
But leaving those people aside, it sounds like you do still kind of think Alice Wu should have made a different movie? Even if all that is true, it’s still not her responsibility. She wrote what she felt inspired by and this is the story she wanted to tell. I think all the choices she made were important to her, not just that it’s f/f, but that it’s in small town Americana, that it’s a white guy she befriends and who begins to understand her, that we can find commonality with anyone. She was inspired to write this after the 2016 elections, there was something more here than just “let me throw something down”. The choices here weren’t a platonic m/f friendship vs a f/f romance, it would have just been this movie or none at all. If anyone’s on the hook here, it’d be Netflix and Hollywood as a whole, who’ve made so few lighter-toned f/f movies that this one has to stand for them all.
I totally get being disappointed by it but two things can be true:
1) I wish this were different
2) Alice Wu can make what she wants
Neither negates the other. It just means you and Alice Wu are different people and like different things, which is totally normal and healthy and fine? It’s only when it goes from “I like something else” to “I wish this was something else” to “this creator should have made something else” that you get near dangerous territory. And honestly, even that last comment is pretty mild, it’s just, when you consider your audience, which is Anyone On the Internet, we want to be a little more careful because often that’s not where it stops, it goes to “this creator is stupid/selfish/bigoted in some way for not doing this instead”. Not saying that’s what you’re saying! Not at all. But I think we all know how things can spiral, or even be open to misinterpretation.
I went to my friend and said actually much more extreme things, because I know she understands where I come from, what exactly irritated me, what I meant and didn’t mean, and most importantly, I knew she was on the same page. Aside from not wanting this to spiral out, I know people are excited about this, I don’t want to ruin it for them. My priority in answering these asks is trying to make sure everyone feels heard but I especially don’t want to take this good thing and bring anyone down.
Which kind of hilariously takes me to literally the very next ask:
And another anon:
alrighty so originally the only things i knew about The Half of It was GAY and alice wu but now having seen the trailer is see that its a little less gay and more about friendship (which is fine). Heres to hoping they go nancy drew-esque in that the guy is like Ace and is more than ok with being friends instead of getting the girl. Either way i will watch and keep any and all negative opinions to myself cause Alice doesnt need or deserve that shit
I do think the guy will be fine, I think it is very much a story of Paul and Ellie’s friendship winning out over everything, not just small-town racism or homophobia but the more focused “relatable”–at least in fiction–issue of liking the same girl. But you know, exactly the same as above except in reverse, you can have your preferences and not like something and not have it be an attack, heh
And another anon:
the ironic thing is alice wu HAS made a romcom with a full on happy ending with saving face years ago but that movie gets so overlooked and underappreciated
She has, she absolutely has, but even if she hadn’t, it wouldn’t have been on her to provide one now.
Although on the other hand, I also don’t think the existence of that or IMAY can be used to stop people from wishing there were more happy f/f romcoms in general. It’s not even like there’s been a jump in the number in the last few years, even though sometimes people act like the lack of rep has been addressed. And that’s aside from the generational differences. Someone who wasn’t born when Saving Face came out could be old enough to be the target audience for this teen movie.
And another anon:
I’m not sure but the trailer looked good. And I like the platonic side
That’s good, anon! I think it’ll be uplifting and even many people, like myself, who wish for something more romance-centric, will like it.